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	<title>Comments on: Mystery</title>
	<atom:link href="http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/</link>
	<description>serious code</description>
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		<title>By: Vincent Bernardi</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-74</link>
		<dc:creator>Vincent Bernardi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Aug 2006 14:36:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-74</guid>
		<description>Shows how much I know. 3.2 is already much more accurate than I would have guessed, seeing how the randomness seems flawed :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shows how much I know. 3.2 is already much more accurate than I would have guessed, seeing how the randomness seems flawed <img src='http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Vincent Bernardi</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-73</link>
		<dc:creator>Vincent Bernardi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Aug 2006 14:34:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-73</guid>
		<description>This comment is mostly to discover what the current value of Pi is, although I have much doubts as to the result. I guess I&#039;ll see after having pressed &quot;Submit&quot; :-)

More to the point, has there been any progress on the subject since last year? For example, has any serious scientific paper been published on the comparative performance issues of the Mac OS X and GNU/Linux system calls?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This comment is mostly to discover what the current value of Pi is, although I have much doubts as to the result. I guess I&#8217;ll see after having pressed &#8220;Submit&#8221; <img src='http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>More to the point, has there been any progress on the subject since last year? For example, has any serious scientific paper been published on the comparative performance issues of the Mac OS X and GNU/Linux system calls?</p>
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		<title>By: ridiculous_fish</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-72</link>
		<dc:creator>ridiculous_fish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 May 2006 17:04:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-72</guid>
		<description>Trackbacks have been disabled on this post due to spam.  Please feel free to leave comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Trackbacks have been disabled on this post due to spam.  Please feel free to leave comments.</p>
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		<title>By: M0DeSTix</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-71</link>
		<dc:creator>M0DeSTix</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Mar 2006 20:39:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-71</guid>
		<description>It is certainly interesting!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is certainly interesting!</p>
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		<title>By: Jussi</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-70</link>
		<dc:creator>Jussi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2005 03:46:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-70</guid>
		<description>Hi, Johann.

Some testing I and some others did pointed in the direction that the Apachebench bug is in the client side. I don&#039;t have an opinion if it is in ab itself or OS X. Under OpenBSD ab runs also stall in a similar way, I assume it to be the same problem.

I&#039;m glad to hear that you are developing better ways to test web server performance because the one you are using now is probably the most non-realworld test there can be. Web servers in a production environment are seldom used from localhost only, and requesting one page only. Also in making good tests there should be as little changing variables as possible. When testing a server should differ make sure that the clients, pages served and apache configurations are identical.

Using one separate client for the apache testing would probably have done a great difference. If your better tests are not ready before the next article please at least use one invariant client. It would show if the problem is really in client or server side.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Johann.</p>
<p>Some testing I and some others did pointed in the direction that the Apachebench bug is in the client side. I don&#8217;t have an opinion if it is in ab itself or OS X. Under OpenBSD ab runs also stall in a similar way, I assume it to be the same problem.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m glad to hear that you are developing better ways to test web server performance because the one you are using now is probably the most non-realworld test there can be. Web servers in a production environment are seldom used from localhost only, and requesting one page only. Also in making good tests there should be as little changing variables as possible. When testing a server should differ make sure that the clients, pages served and apache configurations are identical.</p>
<p>Using one separate client for the apache testing would probably have done a great difference. If your better tests are not ready before the next article please at least use one invariant client. It would show if the problem is really in client or server side.</p>
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		<title>By: Johan Of Anandtech</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-69</link>
		<dc:creator>Johan Of Anandtech</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Sep 2005 17:49:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-69</guid>
		<description>First of all, I like to say that this blog has been very helpful is our search for what exactly is wrong with Mac OS X. Thanks!

But I couldn&#039;t help but react to stingmerman:

&quot;The new Anandtech article still contains the AB flaws and tries to use their flawed benchmark to support their MySQL findings, which to me still indicates that they do not know what they are doing&quot;

First of all, read what Dominik Wagner says:
&quot;My recent investigations in the MySQL source code shows that the F_FULLFSYNC only is in place in the InnoDB table handlers, not in the MyISAM, which makes this argument quite unimportant&quot;

We use MyISAM and I clearly indicated that in the article. No Fsync problem.

About Apachebench: &quot;Why exactly does the client stall? Is it really a bug or is it running out of some resources? We didn&#039;t delve deeper, as we are developing a less synthetic, closer to the real world benchmark to test web servers.&quot;

We posted those benchmarks to show that the apachebench problem does not exist in linux and that the G5 does well there. I clearly indicated that you should take the apachebench results with a bit of salt. So attacking the article on that is a bit lame.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First of all, I like to say that this blog has been very helpful is our search for what exactly is wrong with Mac OS X. Thanks!</p>
<p>But I couldn&#8217;t help but react to stingmerman:</p>
<p>&#8220;The new Anandtech article still contains the AB flaws and tries to use their flawed benchmark to support their MySQL findings, which to me still indicates that they do not know what they are doing&#8221;</p>
<p>First of all, read what Dominik Wagner says:<br />
&#8220;My recent investigations in the MySQL source code shows that the F_FULLFSYNC only is in place in the InnoDB table handlers, not in the MyISAM, which makes this argument quite unimportant&#8221;</p>
<p>We use MyISAM and I clearly indicated that in the article. No Fsync problem.</p>
<p>About Apachebench: &#8220;Why exactly does the client stall? Is it really a bug or is it running out of some resources? We didn&#8217;t delve deeper, as we are developing a less synthetic, closer to the real world benchmark to test web servers.&#8221;</p>
<p>We posted those benchmarks to show that the apachebench problem does not exist in linux and that the G5 does well there. I clearly indicated that you should take the apachebench results with a bit of salt. So attacking the article on that is a bit lame.</p>
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		<title>By: stingmerman</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-68</link>
		<dc:creator>stingmerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Sep 2005 20:19:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-68</guid>
		<description>The new Anandtech article still contains the AB flaws and tries to use their flawed benchmark to support their MySQL findings, which to me still indicates that they do not know what they are doing.  How can we trust their other conclusions?  It just doesn&#039;t make sense that it is a thread creation destruction problem, especially since MySQL uses thread pooling?  It would be nice if somebody who knew what they were doing narrowed it down:

Is it a configuration issue, is it a 4.1 issue resolved in 4.2?  Is it a bug in the testing methodology like the AB bug?  I just feel dirty after reading their article, like I have been abused.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The new Anandtech article still contains the AB flaws and tries to use their flawed benchmark to support their MySQL findings, which to me still indicates that they do not know what they are doing.  How can we trust their other conclusions?  It just doesn&#8217;t make sense that it is a thread creation destruction problem, especially since MySQL uses thread pooling?  It would be nice if somebody who knew what they were doing narrowed it down:</p>
<p>Is it a configuration issue, is it a 4.1 issue resolved in 4.2?  Is it a bug in the testing methodology like the AB bug?  I just feel dirty after reading their article, like I have been abused.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-67</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Sep 2005 14:19:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-67</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s beginning to strongly point to kernel locking issues as the performance bottleneck in OSX.

Linux 2.2 and 2.4 had the same kind of performance issues, overall performance increased significantly with fine-grained locking in 2.6.

Maybe apple will finally fix it in 10.5.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s beginning to strongly point to kernel locking issues as the performance bottleneck in OSX.</p>
<p>Linux 2.2 and 2.4 had the same kind of performance issues, overall performance increased significantly with fine-grained locking in 2.6.</p>
<p>Maybe apple will finally fix it in 10.5.</p>
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		<title>By: Some Dude</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-66</link>
		<dc:creator>Some Dude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Sep 2005 05:16:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-66</guid>
		<description>Your theory has been debunked.
Article starts here:
http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520&amp;p=1
The part that mentions your theory and links to your page is here:
http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520&amp;p=6</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your theory has been debunked.<br />
Article starts here:<br />
<a href="http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520&amp;p=1" rel="nofollow">http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520&amp;p=1</a><br />
The part that mentions your theory and links to your page is here:<br />
<a href="http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520&amp;p=6" rel="nofollow">http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520&amp;p=6</a></p>
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		<title>By: Dominik Wagner</title>
		<link>http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/archives/2005/06/03/mystery/comment-page-1/#comment-65</link>
		<dc:creator>Dominik Wagner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Aug 2005 13:33:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/?p=17#comment-65</guid>
		<description>My recent investigations in the MySQL source code shows that the F_FULLFSYNC only is in place in the InnoDB table handlers, not in the MyISAM, which makes this argument quite unimportant. Since MyISAM is still faster than InnoDB most deployed web-applications use MyISAM. It would be interesting to know, what table handler the Andantech people tested...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My recent investigations in the MySQL source code shows that the F_FULLFSYNC only is in place in the InnoDB table handlers, not in the MyISAM, which makes this argument quite unimportant. Since MyISAM is still faster than InnoDB most deployed web-applications use MyISAM. It would be interesting to know, what table handler the Andantech people tested&#8230;</p>
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